Hatz Biplane Association

We are seriously looking into building a Hatz Classic. We have no aircraft building experience, so some rather basic questions:

1. Has anyone ever started a build without ever having flown, ridden in, or even seen a Hatz? I would hate to think we are the first. Alternatively, if there is a Hatz somewhere between St. Louis and Indianapolis we could come visit it would solve that issue

2. I would estimate that my son and I could invest about 40 hours a month in the project. If we use a Markelan kit as a starting point, how long are we realistically looking at to get up and flying?

3. The Rotac radial is our first choice. Given the short history of the company, one wonders about future serviceability. Worded differently, does anyone know if internal components like pistons and valves are off the shelf?

4. Any other tips for someone starting with a near zero knowledge base are welcome

Chuck

Hi Chuck,

Here's my $1.85 ($.02 doesn't buy anything anymore ):

1. I'm sure there are Hatzs in the area you can get a ride in. I was in the same position as you and got a ride in a CB-1 before ordering plans. I'm glad I did, but the ride just confirmed what I already figured was a good choice. There are a number of midwest based Hatz... I'm sure you can get a ride.

2. Not sure... A few folks on here have built using the Makelan kit(s) as a starting point. Maybe they can help.

3. That question is best asked of Rotec. Some parts are off the shelf, but I'm not sure about the internals. I know that the engine case, PSRU, con rods, and cylinders (and I assume much of the other internals) are produced in house. The items that I would suspect are off the shelf would be the ignition, alternator, prop hub, and maybe the valve train(?). I would ask Rotec.

4. Be diligent about devoting time to it. I've probably lost 2 years of work time due to a variety of reasons. Stay on it. and it'll get done. Talk to other builders, collect pictures of builds (I'm always scrounging for these) as a picture really is worth a thousand words. Think long and hard about what you *really* want your final product to be and plan ahead.

In response to #2, working mostly alone it took about 3600 hours to complete N687HZ with ROTEK 3600. This was the first classic to adapt to the Rotek. The forward formers and stringers from behind the pilot forward and all of the sheet metal and structure had to be redesigned to accommodate the lowered thrustline. There are now several from whom you can benefit. This was my third project so I was pretty well along the learning curve.

The first Hatz I ever rode in was my own. I had sat in Billy Dawson's at OSH 12-15 years ago, but that was the extent of my exposure.

John

Hi Chuck, welcome to the Hatz community!

I was in exactly the same position as you some years ago. I had some flying lessons under my belt but no license yet. I had never built an aircraft before. When I picked a Hatz, I had never seen or ridden in one. But I researched for a long time and listened to the many stories of others who had come to choose a Hatz. Here are the reasons I made my choice:

1. First time builders I spoke to found that it required either basic skills and equipment, or skills that were easily learned with practice. More complex equipment is really a choice. The aircraft can be built with pretty basic shop tools.

2. The comments of Hatz pilots and the apparent ease with which a Hatz can be flown. "As easy as any taildragger" was the consensus.

3. The forum and community. I asked alot of questions here and had such cheerful, helpful responses, I knew I would get the support I needed. And I needed it because I am not located near an airport or an aviation community. I'm building pretty much on my own, except my kids are old enough to help out now.

4. The Classic is just beautiful to look at. That's an opinion, but there it is.

My experience has been that nearly every task is a simple one. That slightly more complex tasks simply require a little more planning and perhaps some advice from the forum, which I always receive. It has sometimes been frustrating, but my patience has increased dramatically, and also my willingness to scrap a finished piece and remake it because it's not quite right. As they say, "Do you want to be sitting at the end of the runway for the first time and wondering if every decision you made was 'good enough' ?" I ask myself that everytime I fabricate a piece. So I know that ever single part in my Hatz is acceptable. Perhaps my favorite side-effect of building the Hatz is that my children are witnessing first-hand that a person can do anything if they put their mind to it.

Anyway, I am perhaps 60% done now. Of that, I've done about 40% in the last two years by myself working maybe 8 hours/week.

Good Luck with your research. I'm sure if you pick a Hatz, you won't be sorry.

Nick

Chuck,

My first flight in a Hatz was when I pushed the throttle forward on NX1279 for it's maiden flight after just under 10 years of building time. I knew in the first 5 seconds that all the reports were right and it was a great little airplane. I'm lucky to get to fly lots of interesting airplanes and have flown Pitt's, Stardusters, Skybolts, etc, plus a lot of antiques. Wacos, TravelAirs, etc. They all have their personalities and cool points, but if I just want to fly for fun, inexpensively, without stress, without needing help moving the airplane in and out of the hangar, just pure open cockpit fun, I'll take the Hatz any day of the week. It's just a real sweetheart of an airplane.

In my opinion, it's only downside is that it's quite a contortion act for passengers to get in and out of the front seat and a little windy for longer trips, but I'm in the back so too bad for them!!!!

Just stick to the plans and don't go off making all kinds of modifications and you'll also wind up with a great airplane

My $0.02

Mark

I'm in the same boat. I should close on my new house today, and will finally have the garage to buy plans and start cutting wood!

I have the same questions, and would love to find someone in Oklahoma to take a ride with.

I am also in agreement with the engine... I hope to use the same engine, but I figure I have a few years before I am ready for that. I can hope for less, but we will see.

Good luck, lets build it together!!!

Tre'

Tre,

I believe the 'Warner Hatz' is in Oklahoma now.

Steve G

Complicated question from an Oldcomer-Kelly-D--

Who's plane is in the 4th pic in the newsletter- (Jim Pinkerton--Brodhead 4)-I already have my LG framed out similar to this plane.
What are you using under the streamlined cuff? Bungees, springs, or aeroil struts??

Sincerely yours,

wassbiplane@tds.net

tlandrum

What part of OKla---I'm in Cyril--between Chickasha & Lawton


wassbiplane

Ada, not too far. Do you have a classic or a Kelly-D? I would really love to get a closer look, and maybe even sit in one before I start actual building...